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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2013 22:31:20 GMT -7
So I've been giving this one some thought for a while now. I can only speak for myself as a novice model builder, and someone who is still learning the fundamentals of car modeling. There are so many people in this modeling club that just build models extremely well, and have amassed a lot of experience through tips from others, trial and error, you name it. Then there are at least some of us (at least I think there are) who have very little experience, but absolutely love building and learning new things when it comes to putting models together. There are some really terrific ideas exchanged here, I know I have certainly learned much more than I knew 3 months ago in my short time here. But I was wondering how you fine builders might feel about putting a little spin on things when it came to knowledge sharing.
What I was thinking of was having an apprentice - master craftsman pairing process, perhaps random, but only volunteers would participate. Then, lets say for a month, while you're working on a build, the apprentice could go to his mentor and ask for advice. Or perhaps the mentor has some progress pics of how he better learned how to build blown engines, etc. This mentor could help with tips for your MOTM build, or maybe another contest you are entering. Of course, they can't do any of the work for you. Everything you submit in a contest has to come from the student's bench.
It is my feeling that this would encourage more lurkers and novice builders to participate more. I can tell you personally I am terrified of entering a contest, just because I know not only will I place dead last, but I couldn't even make the deadlines because I'm too slow for the time being. I am in a couple contests that are coming up, which both have 3 month windows to build in, and that time frame I think I can handle. This is just an idea I thought might help foster more creativity from more members, and it would also forge new friendships, thus bringing us even closer as a community.
The apprenticeship program could even be done once a month or every two months, and just be an ongoing thing as long as there was interest.
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Post by Grandpabeast on Nov 26, 2013 23:28:24 GMT -7
I hear what your sayin schwack, that was sorta the whole idea behind Jerry's Cherry's. I wanted a place where we challenged each other and gave good positive criticisms. Where we learned from each other and shared ideas. It was why we started doing "how to's" and offering up info on the Reference Thread. I want this whole site to be an Apprenticeship! We dont need a special time each month or assigned mentors , If you have a problem or a question ask . We are all here to help! What is better then 1 mentor ....111 mentors ( thats how many members we have ). I tried to address this when we were talking about young builders being intimidated or not wanting to post builds or enter contests. Out in the modeling world once you hit 16 you are thrown into the Adult category and you are going to be competing against us anyway so just start doing it. No one here is going to put anyone down. This an anti drama, anti intimidation, anti bulling site and I think I can speak for most, we are all ready to help. Let this site be your mentor, train and learn from all of us and then go clean house at your next local contest. I have said it before and I stand by it I have seen some of the best builds in 6 months here then I have in the last 5 years. We have some of the best builders, detailers, painters and idea guys you are going to find !
As for dead lines, all you have to do is follow the rules. I am building models for contests that are for June, July and August, just take the pictures and post them when it is time. If I wait every time till the month I wouldnt get any done either.
So what if you finish dead last, it didnt cost you anything! Ask everyone to critique your build , ask for good and bad. Then learn from it , take that info and use it when you build the next one and so on and so on. Remember some of us have been building for 30 or more years. And I will tell you not only did i recently finish dead last, but I didnt even get a vote! Why because even I voted for the winner ! Never have such a big ego that you cannt tell when someone is truely better then you. Instead go back and build something that will make him vote for you next time. So far in 6 months of J'sC's ( 6 MOTM and 6 Bracket Races along with 1 Challenge ) I have only won once. Its not really about winning or losing its about having fun build models.
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Post by CustomMuscle on Nov 27, 2013 2:58:39 GMT -7
Schwack also feel free to PM anyone myself included if you don't want ask something on an open thread.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2013 4:10:36 GMT -7
Schwack, I've been building since i was 8, and am about to turn 52. In that time I have built literally thousands of kits. My cousin got me interested in building, but I moved away shortly after really getting hooked. This was way before the internet so there were no forums to belong to. Until I found places like J's C's and a few others, everything I did was self-taught thru a lot of trial and error. Since then, though I have seen so much done, and with the pics provided, been given an idea of how to. After over 40 years of building, there is still so much I haven't figured out, and I still ask questions.
I don't know if there is anything I can help with, but feel free to ask me anythiing about building. Whether it is how I did something on one of my builds, or just a general question
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2013 8:50:16 GMT -7
I personally like the idea about the apprenticeship program/contest. Because some of these builders don't want to put themselves out there and feel embarrassed. I was there once. Also might be coming from other sites where they are huge jerks, for lack of a better word. I won't mention the sites but they don't give you advice, they tear apart your builds and something you feel proud of, they tell u it sucks.
Schwack, and for anyone that would like help, if you don't want to put yourself out there, reach out to someone through PM. I, for one, would love to help out. I don't mind taking more progress pics if it helps you. I might not be an expert at everything but if I can't give you the expertise knowledge, I'll find someone that can.
Or how does this sound, and Beast, weigh in here, how about we start a thread with requests for tutorials. People can then volunteer and create a thread with those instructions. If there isn't anyone here that can provide the info, we can look elsewhere for a tutorial and bring it here. Once the request has been completed, we delete it and leave the tutorial. If it's something that you do not want to out yourself out there with, PM me or beast and we'll have one single post that we can update as requests come in. That way they're anonymous. You guys can post the How To's in a clean build.
Those are my thought. Kudos to you, Schwack, for asking for help when you need it and bringing this touchy subject forward.
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Post by Grandpabeast on Nov 27, 2013 14:07:08 GMT -7
I guess I dont get it ! The whole idea behind this site is not having to be behind closed doors. Its supposed to be an open site for all! If we have a bad apple that is scaring people then he needs to go. I want everyone to be free to openly ask questions.
As for tutorials and threads.....we have all of that, We have a reference section, we have "how tos" ( I quite doing mine because I was asking for feedback and not getting it so I thought no one was interested ) we have tutorials.
Go back and read some of the threads....we just covered one about a week or two ago about young builders being intimidated about joining contests. I just judged a contest for Hobby lobby they had two divisions youth ( up to 16 ) and Adult . So unless we have members younger then 16 we all fall into the adult division, with that said test your self here, learn from us , ask us questions and you will get better. Again some of us have been building for 30 to 40 years so dont expect to be that good if you have only just started.
Am I just missing the whole point here ?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2013 16:32:15 GMT -7
I think having a section with tutorials is a great thing, and am glad there is one here. What I think Iceman was suggesting is a way to get a tutorial done on a specific topic / procedure - sort of like requesting your local library to use their share program to get you a book they don't already have on the shelf - istead of waiting until it shows up in someone's build and THEN asking for a how to thread. I think everyone here has an area of building that is their "specialty" or "niche". It may be wiring an engine so it looks like it could fire up and run, or detailing a dashboard to where it looks like they sat in a real car to take the pic. Some may be able to do flawless custom paint jobs, or along the same lines be able to tell exactly when the paint for the airbrush is thinned down just right. Some builders choose a specific area to build in, and have done enough of them that they have it down to a science, so their Jeff Gordon Monte Carlo is worthy of being displayed in the museum at Daytona. Whatever it may be, they have something that could help other builders, but don't think about it until someone asks.
I am not a fan of contests. There are just too many individual qualifications to consider. Setting up divisions by age, like the Hobby Lobby contest mentioned, isn't fair because you can have a 15 year old who has built over 100 kits going up against a 7 year old who is just starting. Going by experience can even be unfair based on what the people have built and the theme for the contest - both doing 50 kits, with one all NASCAR and the other a mix of everything from aircraft to submarines. Even the brand of kit can make the difference, so the one who can afford Tamiya already has an advantage over the person stuck with Lindberg. For online contests, the type of camera used, photography skills, and knowing how to show off the best areas of what you did can alter the perception of the builds. Available equipment can make a difference, too - the person stuck using rattle can paint or a brush is not going to be able to detail a paint job like the one with the airbrush and all the tips. Finally, there are the voters/judges. Do they actually take the time to look at all the details, or just pick the one that looks best on the outside?
All this being said, I can understand why newer builders, and some older ones, are hesitant to enter contests. When you make an entry that is by far the best build you have ever done - first time with engine wiring, best paint and decals, interior detailing, etc., but lose out to people who have done their usual builds that in some cases are just better by virtue of experience (overall or in the chosen theme)or what they have to work with (starting kit, tools, etc.), it can be discouraging, even if there are nothing but positive comments made on the in-progress posts and the finished build.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2013 17:14:00 GMT -7
I get what ya mean schwack, but at the same return, we are all mentors here. i'm just getting back into this stuff too, but I find reading a tutorial, asking questions, then giving it hell gets the job done [or two or three tries, lol...] I find this place IS different from other sites, as we all seem to have the same idea, it's a hobby - not a job. I think with building models [as with many things in life], if you have the info, you just have to apply it, may not always work, but experience is the key. as far as contests go, I just build slow, and am into rigs, so for now no entries for me, but that is going to change. just remember, have fun and try stuff, it's only plastic
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Post by Deleted on Nov 27, 2013 19:34:01 GMT -7
Wow, I didn't expect this many responses. I agree with what all of you are saying. Sometimes, I just feel like I am too new, and I have to get over that "no question is stupid" hump. And Grandpabeast, you're right, there are a ton of mentors here. I just have to learn to reach out better. Thank you fine gents for the feedback, it helps me understand better. You'll have to forgive me, sometimes I see all these guys just whipping out builds like the wind and I am just overwhelmed with the feeling of never being able to get to that point. Not only am I learning how to build models, I am learning how to ask for help when it comes to stuff like this. I really appreciate all of you offering to lend a hand, and believe me, I'll try to make it a point to take more advantage of that help. Jerry's Cherry's is truly an awesome modeling club, and I'm still struggling with being out of my league. I need to overcome that, and understand the community better as a whole.
Thanks to all of you for helping me understand better.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2013 7:05:10 GMT -7
whipping out builds......in my case it looks like 2 months is a quick build, haha. it's all good, after all, no one knows everything and I think the idea of this place is to spread knowledge. now, I think you had a question....
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Post by Grandpabeast on Nov 28, 2013 12:33:51 GMT -7
Schwack your not out of your league. We just have been doing it longer. I give you my word that we are all here to help you. If you have a question about how to do something, check the tutorials and the "How Tos". If it was something specific on a members build or finished kit just ask that member ( either open thread or pm ) I am sure we would be happy to explain, take pictures or even do a "How To" just to help. Then .....enter some of the contests. You can look at the themes for 2014 and start building now( just take your pics and dont post till required ). When you enter or even just when you post a build, ask for members to critique your build. They will give you positive feedback both good and bad about your build. An just know its their opinion so if they think you chopped it to much , well thats their opinion, always do what you like. ( by the way it is imposable to chop too much ! Ha Ha )
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2013 13:05:57 GMT -7
Thank you for the advice Grandpabeast, it is appreciated.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2013 13:45:59 GMT -7
That's right if you think you've chopped too much, you've really just set up for a convertible. Lol
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